I see the 2d admendment as what enables all the other ones to stand. However this current arguement that school kids should all be armed is the wrong direction to go. If you build a false paradigm of arm the students or disarm everyone you risk losing.
it is not a very good approach to say guns should be in schools. guns should not be in schools. But again damn stop blaming this on the guns the lack of them or the access to them. This is not the guns. Other countries have guns and they dont have the problem with them that the US has.
The old saying rings true. Guns don't kill people, poeple kill people, (with guns).
Why did this latest shooter do it? What is wrong with our culture? Also where is the police force when they are needed. Police normally show up after a murder and collect details about it. Rarely do they find a murderer. Just look at the number of homocided vs convictions. Police were all armored up yet no one tried to get in a shoot out. The Colorado story was the same they stood out side in all their fancy black gear refusing to go in while the shooters had a feild day.
I want to keep our guns
I want to keep our guns
Last edited by Ry on Tue Apr 17, 2007 3:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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sangre_de_soldado
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Wow, I bet that debate team is VERY persuasive!
The problem with arming a child is not what he or she may do with it.
When you carry a weapon, or worse yet, brandish a weapon...you'd better use it, cuz if it is taken from you - you're fucked. Would every child be ready to use that weapon? Would they understand the impact using that weapon has..the far reaching consequences. Just basically those concerns.
A knife necklace? That sounds ... like an accident waiting to happen (definatley NOT safety first). Really anything can be used as a weapon, it would be better to teach your child "improvisation", then to send him to school packing. I always found a lit cigarette a great distraction for instance. You can flick it on target from almost any hand position, and use it as the one second distraction you need to gain control of the situation. Or a pencil, which you could jab in and break off (so it cant be removed), maybe twice if it is a new pencil (sharpened but still full length). The biggest thing when faced with a gun is to close the distance before the gun is drawn, and to jam (lock) the arm or hand that is reaching for it (a sword technique from Iai which works in this instance without a sword). Other than that hand vs. gun is typically a no win situation.
Sorry, im really a nice guy.
The problem with arming a child is not what he or she may do with it.
When you carry a weapon, or worse yet, brandish a weapon...you'd better use it, cuz if it is taken from you - you're fucked. Would every child be ready to use that weapon? Would they understand the impact using that weapon has..the far reaching consequences. Just basically those concerns.
A knife necklace? That sounds ... like an accident waiting to happen (definatley NOT safety first). Really anything can be used as a weapon, it would be better to teach your child "improvisation", then to send him to school packing. I always found a lit cigarette a great distraction for instance. You can flick it on target from almost any hand position, and use it as the one second distraction you need to gain control of the situation. Or a pencil, which you could jab in and break off (so it cant be removed), maybe twice if it is a new pencil (sharpened but still full length). The biggest thing when faced with a gun is to close the distance before the gun is drawn, and to jam (lock) the arm or hand that is reaching for it (a sword technique from Iai which works in this instance without a sword). Other than that hand vs. gun is typically a no win situation.
Sorry, im really a nice guy.
Last edited by Saint on Tue Apr 17, 2007 1:01 am, edited 2 times in total.
To be the tree that will not bend when the winds of change are blowing, is to be the tree that will be broken in the strongest winds of unknowing.
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-saint
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sangre_de_soldado
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Well he was talking about making it legal. Believe me my school has so much trouble with gangs it's unbelievable especially since only like 6 years ago there was like 0% crime there.SLCThunk wrote:I can tell you that students in California DO have guns.
Maybe not my school, but my girlfriend's high school has a lockdown every 2 months or so, and constant gang fights. There's a gun or two on campus at any moment.
And of course, that school isn't even one of the bad schools, that's just a common school with common problems. Although it has a great debate team.
I don't know about arming kids, but I do know that some kids go to school with knives hidden in their crucifix necklaces or shoes or such, not because they're bad kids but because they need protection from gangs. I can't reason why they shouldn't, safety first.
Ok, but just making it legal for a gun doesnt teach a child the resposibilty or maturity he or she needs to understand before even thinking of using it. And I certainly dont want armed teachers. Or even a gun in a "Break glass in case of emergency" case. I dont know man, Im not so old I didnt face these problems myself. All children (youngg adults) should be studying self defense, instead of pretending with games like tekken (not directed at anyone). Martial Arts are actually in threat of losing various variations of styles, some of which enjoy a long standing tradition. Plus almost all of these values we discuss are taught in conjuction with the style itself. I recommend Aikido or Wing Chun personally. Many of the "soft" styles give you an advantage against a stronger opponent, since you use their strength against them.
To be the tree that will not bend when the winds of change are blowing, is to be the tree that will be broken in the strongest winds of unknowing.
-saint
-saint
I hate weapons and gangs its the only time people could mouth off to me is if they had a weapon that could fire. you really dont need a weapon in school, plenty are already there. Rip a soda can by folding it back and forth a few times and its a razor sharp blade. unscrew a desk leg and its a club or just use the whole desk or the chair. its not hard to kill someone when you use a weapon. Ill take a chair over a silly necklace knife or whatever anyday. The thing is only a gun and beat a gun.
gangs are for pussies. my schools had gangs but minus the guns even with the stupid brass knuckles and kives and crap they had they were nothing. pretty much any thug type from California that moved to Virginia would just get his ass kicked by a hevy handed redneck. I remember we had some crypts come down to NC because of drugs coming in on our island. These were not run of the mill dudes they were the drug pushers sent to come get this stuff. Well it was easy to spot people you did not know esp with them wearing blue and dressing in a very foreign style. My brother and I baited three of them with a cute girl and when they came around motels to the beach we just beat the shit out of them. This guy with all these tattoos and shit actually started crying. I believe we put that one in a dumpster. The best part is my brother and I were like 15 years old doing this, that is how pathedic they were at fighitng. I kicked a guy in the neck he was done and we just tackled the other two (easy because of the baggy clothes) choked them out and then kicked them in the face on the ground to wake them up. Just like a soccer ball. Their faces looked like a purple mess with a hole in it.
They shot out some windows at a bar where people were mean to them because they were total dicks. Well that was stupid because they cars stood out like no other and they all ended up pushed into the Pamlico Sound in the night. They thought they had a great deal in place with like seriouosly maybe 6 cops. But they didn:t understand the local population.
I hate gangs and I hate guns. Pussies need numbers and fire arms. and it is so stupid to make gangs of ethnicities or even streets. They have to live vicariously through group power because they are insecure and they are insecure because anyone can have a gun.
gangs are for pussies. my schools had gangs but minus the guns even with the stupid brass knuckles and kives and crap they had they were nothing. pretty much any thug type from California that moved to Virginia would just get his ass kicked by a hevy handed redneck. I remember we had some crypts come down to NC because of drugs coming in on our island. These were not run of the mill dudes they were the drug pushers sent to come get this stuff. Well it was easy to spot people you did not know esp with them wearing blue and dressing in a very foreign style. My brother and I baited three of them with a cute girl and when they came around motels to the beach we just beat the shit out of them. This guy with all these tattoos and shit actually started crying. I believe we put that one in a dumpster. The best part is my brother and I were like 15 years old doing this, that is how pathedic they were at fighitng. I kicked a guy in the neck he was done and we just tackled the other two (easy because of the baggy clothes) choked them out and then kicked them in the face on the ground to wake them up. Just like a soccer ball. Their faces looked like a purple mess with a hole in it.
They shot out some windows at a bar where people were mean to them because they were total dicks. Well that was stupid because they cars stood out like no other and they all ended up pushed into the Pamlico Sound in the night. They thought they had a great deal in place with like seriouosly maybe 6 cops. But they didn:t understand the local population.
I hate gangs and I hate guns. Pussies need numbers and fire arms. and it is so stupid to make gangs of ethnicities or even streets. They have to live vicariously through group power because they are insecure and they are insecure because anyone can have a gun.
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Fragilityh14
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the thing is this WASNT an elementary school, it was a COLLEGE, very different situation.
I just want to say, that I grew up in a rural area where everyone has guns and they are very common and I can't think of any instances of gun violence or someone getting shot etc, except maybe a murder within a 50 mile radius once a year or so.
it's lame that these students couldn't keep their hunting rifles in their rooms, what if they don't live close to campus?
I am not sure what the policy of the school I went to is on firearms on campus but you can't have them in housing...but it is not a school with a population that would be hunting...however the police are armed. My main problem is that the government wants more and more military style police and heavily armed beauracrats who wont help you in anyway and we are supposed to give up our own defenses?
I just want to say, that I grew up in a rural area where everyone has guns and they are very common and I can't think of any instances of gun violence or someone getting shot etc, except maybe a murder within a 50 mile radius once a year or so.
it's lame that these students couldn't keep their hunting rifles in their rooms, what if they don't live close to campus?
I am not sure what the policy of the school I went to is on firearms on campus but you can't have them in housing...but it is not a school with a population that would be hunting...however the police are armed. My main problem is that the government wants more and more military style police and heavily armed beauracrats who wont help you in anyway and we are supposed to give up our own defenses?
No so far everyone seems to understand the inportance of keeping firearms. Just not in schools.
If my son wants to hunt he can come home and hunt. What if his gun is stolen from school, where it may not be as safe as in my house. Worse yet, used against him or his friends. Imagine the guilt he would wrestle with over knowing had he only left it at home. He would suffer from anguish AND guilt, instead of just anguish.
If my son wants to hunt he can come home and hunt. What if his gun is stolen from school, where it may not be as safe as in my house. Worse yet, used against him or his friends. Imagine the guilt he would wrestle with over knowing had he only left it at home. He would suffer from anguish AND guilt, instead of just anguish.
To be the tree that will not bend when the winds of change are blowing, is to be the tree that will be broken in the strongest winds of unknowing.
-saint
-saint
I can already see the tides turning and we will lose our guns in America. It is only a matter of time. Foriegn countries see this and I am sure laugh at us, "thats what they get".
The media LOVES it. 32 deaths will boost sales for a while while keeping them away from important stuff. The media protstitutes the victims. I can't believe everyone saying they don't want to report uncomfirmed data, and then do it.
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In a broader view of things I see this as the way the system is supposed to work. Republicans take away some rights, Democrats take different rights. Slowly but surely.
The Republicans=gun rights. This is one of their main bases. However the "Rebulicans" currently in office have forever tarnished all Republicans and pretty soon it will be ALL Democrats in office. President, Congress, Senate. Bye bye gun rights.
I just wonder what people will do when they try to confiscate and so on. Could the government even do it? The logistics make it almost impossible to enact and perform a confiscation of guns. Yeah, that is what I will tell myself.
The media LOVES it. 32 deaths will boost sales for a while while keeping them away from important stuff. The media protstitutes the victims. I can't believe everyone saying they don't want to report uncomfirmed data, and then do it.
. In a broader view of things I see this as the way the system is supposed to work. Republicans take away some rights, Democrats take different rights. Slowly but surely.
The Republicans=gun rights. This is one of their main bases. However the "Rebulicans" currently in office have forever tarnished all Republicans and pretty soon it will be ALL Democrats in office. President, Congress, Senate. Bye bye gun rights.
I just wonder what people will do when they try to confiscate and so on. Could the government even do it? The logistics make it almost impossible to enact and perform a confiscation of guns. Yeah, that is what I will tell myself.